Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2014 15:54:31 GMT
The Finns created controversy with that treaty by allowing the East Karelian uprising. They also broke the treaty of Moscow, so the Finns have their fair share of rule breaking and then some.
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Post by Jontti500 on Aug 13, 2014 17:02:59 GMT
Guess both sides are to be blamed, but i still Think that th russians were more guilty, their acts caused the Most deaths and many of those deaths where my ancestlrs, i can never forgive Stalin for that
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Post by Trowa on Aug 14, 2014 11:30:47 GMT
Guess both sides are to be blamed, but i still Think that th russians were more guilty, their acts caused the Most deaths and many of those deaths where my ancestlrs, i can never forgive Stalin for that No one will ever forgive Stalin his only saving grace in life is that there was a bigger piece of shit named Hitler alive and in power at the same time as him. Edit: Bigger piece of shit might even be a stretch. They both were pretty equally insane and bloodthirsty.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 23:40:45 GMT
Jontti500I'm not asking for you to forgive Stalin for his deeds, but I am trying to show how both parties were at fault for how WW2 played out. They were both quite guilty for what they did and the role they played, but it is a matter of how you see it unfold. For example, when you say the Russians caused more deaths in the war, that is false; the Finnish killed plenty more Russians than vice-versa. The Winter War and the subsequent Continuation War amassed 89 000 Finnish soldiers ending up either dead or missing; the Russians, however, tolled in at 391 000 dead or missing. Now I know there's always the claim that the Soviets instigated the wars, but this is also false. The Great Patriotic war was triggered by the breach of the Moscow Peace Treaty by Finland, and that war ended up creating the majority of casualties for both sides in their feud. TrowaAd hominem doesn't make the Finns' guilt in the two wars a write off; sure Stalin was a horrible man, but to use that as a way to prove the USSR's guilt in external affairs is regrettably naive. Now I won't go so far as to claim the Soviet's were in the right throughout the entire set of wars, but I can assure you they were justified in many of their actions due to Finnish faults that preceded it.
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Post by Trowa on Aug 16, 2014 0:13:06 GMT
Jontti500I'm not asking for you to forgive Stalin for his deeds, but I am trying to show how both parties were at fault for how WW2 played out. They were both quite guilty for what they did and the role they played, but it is a matter of how you see it unfold. For example, when you say the Russians caused more deaths in the war, that is false; the Finnish killed plenty more Russians than vice-versa. The Winter War and the subsequent Continuation War amassed 89 000 Finnish soldiers ending up either dead or missing; the Russians, however, tolled in at 391 000 dead or missing. Now I know there's always the claim that the Soviets instigated the wars, but this is also false. The Great Patriotic war was triggered by the breach of the Moscow Peace Treaty by Finland, and that war ended up creating the majority of casualties for both sides in their feud. TrowaAd hominem doesn't make the Finns' guilt in the two wars a write off; sure Stalin was a horrible man, but to use that as a way to prove the USSR's guilt in external affairs is regrettably naive. Now I won't go so far as to claim the Soviet's were in the right throughout the entire set of wars, but I can assure you they were justified in many of their actions due to Finnish faults that preceded it. Where the did I say anything about the Finns'?! !?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!?!?! I just said Stalin was a piece of shit....
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Deleted
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Registered on: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 0:15:55 GMT
Jontti500I'm not asking for you to forgive Stalin for his deeds, but I am trying to show how both parties were at fault for how WW2 played out. They were both quite guilty for what they did and the role they played, but it is a matter of how you see it unfold. For example, when you say the Russians caused more deaths in the war, that is false; the Finnish killed plenty more Russians than vice-versa. The Winter War and the subsequent Continuation War amassed 89 000 Finnish soldiers ending up either dead or missing; the Russians, however, tolled in at 391 000 dead or missing. Now I know there's always the claim that the Soviets instigated the wars, but this is also false. The Great Patriotic war was triggered by the breach of the Moscow Peace Treaty by Finland, and that war ended up creating the majority of casualties for both sides in their feud. TrowaAd hominem doesn't make the Finns' guilt in the two wars a write off; sure Stalin was a horrible man, but to use that as a way to prove the USSR's guilt in external affairs is regrettably naive. Now I won't go so far as to claim the Soviet's were in the right throughout the entire set of wars, but I can assure you they were justified in many of their actions due to Finnish faults that preceded it. Where the did I say anything about the Finns'?!???!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!??!?!?! I just said Stalin was a piece of shit.... My mistake. I was under the impression we were still on about the OP's topic.
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Post by Hale on Aug 16, 2014 0:16:35 GMT
are we Finnish-ed ?
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axdsilva
Member
SO distracted...
Posts: 403
Registered on: July 2014
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Post by axdsilva on Aug 16, 2014 0:21:48 GMT
Not sure why I felt the need or what fact this deserved a quote but there it is =P
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Post by Jontti500 on Aug 16, 2014 9:29:09 GMT
When i said that the russians caused more deaths then the finns, i was talking about the whole of world war 2
I think i'm going to let this rest now. this was one hell of a lesson in philosofy and history.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2014 18:20:43 GMT
When i said that the russians caused more deaths then the finns, i was talking about the whole of world war 2 I think i'm going to let this rest now. this was one hell of a lesson in philosofy and history. It definitely was. Thank you for the fine discussion; I learn a lot about the The Winter War, The Continuation war, and The Great Patriotic War in this discussion.
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