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Post by Trowa on Aug 28, 2014 8:45:27 GMT
"I didnt even touch you on my screen"
We have all heard it, you might have even said it once or twice or a 100 times. This isnt about one person, this is about the entire crew including myself at times. This isnt naming and shaming. This is a friendly reminder of rule #2 possibly the most important rule to this crew and its easily forgotten. 2) Clean racing is encouraged at all times between crew members. Do what you like with your friends, enemies, or random people in random lobbies, but when racing other crew members you should aim to be as clean as possible. This means not taking people out intentionally, waiting for someone if it was your fault they had a crash (accidentally or not)
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IF for whatever reason a car is spun out because of something you did you need to own it. Accept it and people will reward you with the same treatment if they pit you. Far too much undercutting and block passing is cast off as "on my screen it was clean". NEWSFLASH it doesnt matter what happened on your screen. If you cause an accident you need to wait. If someone says "woah wtf man" 10/10 times you pitted them on their screen and the rule doesnt say if it looked clean on your screen drive on. It says ACCIDENTALLY OR NOT. Here is a clip of Broughy1322 doing just that. His word is god around here (sorry Broughy it just is) so if you dont like what I have to say watch our leader exhibit how its done folks Now he does drive off afterwards the second time but you can clearly see he wanted to wait and should have waited but he went for the win. No one is perfect and this is both an example of what to do and what not to do at the same time. Twilicane is robbed of first place not once but twice. Does it suck to have to wait? yes but these are our guidelines and the more we ignore them the dirtier and dirtier our crew will become making excuse after excuse on why "it wasnt my fault". Well Im sorry if you dont feel it was technically your fault but /rant What are your thoughts on the matter? |
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Regnomo
Member
Posts: 110 
Registered on: April 2014
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Post by Regnomo on Aug 28, 2014 8:52:50 GMT
I can't agree more,this needed to be said,thank you for all the effort you put in your posts !
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Registered on: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 9:02:52 GMT
Yeah it really annoys me when that happens and they don't wait.If it looks like I hit someone on their screen I usually try to wait and let them pass me.However if there's lots of people right behind me I usually keep driving and just let the guy pass me if he catches up.
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parksguard
Member
You've met with a terrible fate, haven't you?
Posts: 1,227
Registered on: June 2014
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Post by parksguard on Aug 28, 2014 9:11:51 GMT
I wait when the touch is visible on my screen. If I am getting close to the person, but not touching them and I see their car buck without touching me or a prop I will wait. However, it is not always apparent why someone crashes. Example: on a hair pin with trees on the outskirts: If I am on the inside and happen to go wide with someone on the outside of my rear wheels approaching my door and that person crashes into a tree, it is very feasible I hit him on his screen even though I did not experience any ramifications on my screen, or that person reacted to my wide turn, lost traction, or something else and crashed into that tree on their own. Both scenarios are equally likely. Chances are either way I will continue the race as usual considering you do not have 100% visibility of the incident at the default camera angle. Now, if the person is in the chat I always ask did I hit you or I will message them over PSN? I can only hope that person tells the truth, especially on a public medium and does not besmirch my name or racing integrity to others. TL;DR?: Not all situations are created equal so therefore it is not always possible to tell the difference between lag touch or other driver error. Unless you are EderForty. His internet is made up of twigs and rocks apparently xD |
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Post by Pundip on Aug 28, 2014 9:34:47 GMT
The annoying thing is that we don't know who was lagging in those situations. Apart from those two incidents, there was no glitching all over the track that you usually get with lag.
It was very honourable for Broughy to stop the first time and although he wanted to do the right thing the second time, he did not physically see or feel any contact (on both occasions) so decided to carry on when other drivers were catching. Sometimes you do just make those split second decisions, whether they are right or wrong, you have to make a decision there and then which is very easy to get wrong especially in a competitive environment.
I agree that the old "on my screen" is far too often used as a get out of jail free card. I've even used it in the past when it genuinely happens but I do always try my best to wait and then also after the race apologise. I will always try to explain why I did what I did if it is a racing incident i.e. locked up during braking or understeer etc and not a lag/screen issue.
At the end of the day these things happen and there is no way to get rid of them 100%. When I fell hard done by, as long as a sincere apology is made and preferably an explanation for their actions then I am ok with it.
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Post by Renegade1911 on Aug 28, 2014 10:13:01 GMT
You are entirely right Trowa.
However, I think there are situations where the fault is actually on the other side, with the guy in front. Like, if you're coming back on the track after you screwed up, you don't look where you're going and I ram you and destroy you again, it's your fault. The same is when the person in front makes a mistake, slides into me and then ends in a ditch while I don't, again, I'm not stopping.
Also one thing I feel the need to adress is shutting the doors in a turn. Happened to me quite a few times these last couple days. I'm heading for a corner with somebody else, I'm on the inside and have my front wheel alongside their rear wheel. Then when we approach the apex they just shut the door on me to hit it, but I'm already there, so they spin out. That's not my fault. When this happens, all you can do is roll with it and let us both get through that corner. Otherwise you'll end up spinning and smashing the nearest wall or car. I don't want that, it makes me look guilty. You don't want that, you're loosing positions!
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Post by Trowa on Aug 28, 2014 10:14:08 GMT
It is probably worth noting that if you dont play with a mic you are at a severe disadvantage as you cannot alert people of what happened right away. Raging after the race is pretty much pointless and just creates arguments.
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ChrisDE22
Member
Posts: 473
Registered on: May 2014
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Post by ChrisDE22 on Aug 28, 2014 10:50:25 GMT
What Broughy did is probably the best thing, as long as there is no one else behind w8 and try to overtake again, but if it's gonna cost you places and it's just the connection's fault then you better just go 4 it
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Post by Renegade1911 on Aug 28, 2014 11:06:42 GMT
Also what needs to be said is that if you should block the road entirely by waiting, just go. Waiting for them person you harmed at a later point or not waiting at all is still better than screwing it up for someone else or even everybody else by blocking the path and causing a massive crash.
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Post by Pundip on Aug 28, 2014 11:26:17 GMT
Also what needs to be said is that if you should block the road entirely by waiting, just go. Waiting for them person you harmed at a later point or not waiting at all is still better than screwing it up for someone else or even everybody else by blocking the path and causing a massive crash. I find this happens way too often, and when it does the majority tend to just slam on the brakes instead of gradually pulling over which causes more problems than it solves. Best thing to do if you have to wait for someone is move off the racing line, keep driving but at a slower pace then start racing again when you have let the person you offed past. I find a lot off first corner pile ups are caused by trying to wait immediately then and there instead of finding somewhere safer and off line to wait. I've witnessed and I'm sure many others in this crew will have as well. |
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EderForty
Member
Posts: 238
Registered on: June 2014
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Post by EderForty on Aug 28, 2014 15:17:03 GMT
it is not always possible to tell the difference between lag touch or other driver error. Unless you are EderForty. His internet is made up of twigs and rocks apparently xD So remember, fellow NODOs, if I hit you in a race it is always because of lagg, I never make mistakes on track  Jokes aside, I agree that we should try to wait if we or our lagg causes someone to crash. I have been experiencing severe lagg lately and try to keep an eye on people spinning "magically" (although as Parksguard says, sometimes lagg will affect people who is directly behind you, and this situations are extremely difficult to see, if not impossible). However, there is people who will complain after every touch, even if it did not cause a crash. We all need to learn that we can't demand/expect other people to always wait when they hit us. Sometimes we will be hit by another laggy car and nobody else will even notice, other times it will be because several cars are involved. Broughy himself chooses not to wait if doing so means losing several positions, not only in the video at the OP but in other videos as well. If someone does that to me I would be happy with an explanation/apology after the race, but others rage immediately and don't even give a chance for the other driver to explain. Finally, on my lagg: I am sorry. I really am. Nobody would be happier than me if I could find a way to solve it. I am trying to work out why this is happening now, when it didn't happen some time ago (at least at the same level). Please bear with me while it lasts, or consider doing some non-contact races from time to time if this keeps being annoying. |
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Post by Broughy1322 on Aug 28, 2014 19:15:01 GMT
Good points raised by all. As I said in that video it's difficult at times and it is often a judgement call, but it's always better to be on the more "careful" side and wait if you were unsure. As said using a mic also helps or at least contacting the person after the race (as I did to twi in that one). Also good point about stopping immediately, that's not necessary and can cause issues. You'll see in the next GTA vid another way to do it when I let Blue back past me a good 10-20 seconds after I initially caused him harm (if the person you hit is quite quick it can also help you not lose too many positions yourself).
And finally great point from eder about people complaining quite a lot. I noticed this a bit in the quick playlist I did last week and one of the guys who caused an issue at one point and didn't have a mic messaged me to apologise and felt bad about people openly complaining about him. The ironic thing is that it wasn't even his fault - I went up the inside of him and he had nowhere to go, which caused others to turn into him on a much wider line (it also didn't help that I wasn't aware of a corner cut everyone else was using on that particular track haha).
So yeah I think everyone needs to remember that outside of official events this is all just a bit of fun. Less of the complaining and less of the driving away when clearly (accidentally or not) causing an issue for someone else and blaming it on lag.
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TimeeR
Member
Trains <3
Posts: 100 
Registered on: July 2014
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Post by TimeeR on Aug 28, 2014 19:41:43 GMT
It has happend 70% of the time when I play with Americans, maybe that is why I suck in contact races that I've never played, I don't want to be near to other people's cars, I'm so worried about it, this is why at the beginning of races I let everyone pass so I don't cause any trouble.
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parksguard
Member
You've met with a terrible fate, haven't you?
Posts: 1,227
Registered on: June 2014
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Post by parksguard on Aug 28, 2014 20:12:28 GMT
As Scot playing in America, I do not experience any lag playing with most of the crew that is across the pond. I have only had a problem with forty occasionally, but it never directly effected me during a race and it is certainly not his fault. I myself am a really aggressive driver and defend my lines as hard as possible. Especially if I am on the racing line ahead of someone who trying to take me on the inside of a turn like Renegade1911 used in his example. I will close the door 10/10 times because I have the advantage of both entering the corner 1st, the entry speed, and the racing line. There is no reason I should yield. It may seem to be an unnecessary risk, and yes I have payed for using this method of racing. And I have lost positions and races because of it much like my previous example of Prost v Senna at Japan in 1990. Except in those instances the other racer was not intentionally hitting me, they were just using elegys which cannot break for shit. Not really either racers' fault per se. Sorry that was slightly off topic from the lag discussion but still relevant to instances when racing goes wrong. |
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Jon
Member
If you have everything under control, you're not going fast enough.
Posts: 224
Registered on: July 2014
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Post by Jon on Aug 28, 2014 22:16:38 GMT
One quick note: Watch where you are coming back onto the track, 50% of pile-ups are caused by a racer in a front position blindly returning onto the track without looking.
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